Second Coming

[Falconer02]

I'll take it then, that you are unable to disprove them.  Thanks!

"The majority of the prophecies were false, but this 1 is vaguely true if you interpret it my way, therefore the bible is infallible."

I've seen people who speak to ghosts make more accurate predictions. If we're seriously going to dive this deep into hokey ideas, then I believe Nostradamus should be added to the discussion since his predictions, when interpreted in specific ways, have been fairly more accurate than xtian doctrine.

[falcon9]

I'll take it then, that you are unable to disprove them.  Thanks!

"The majority of the prophecies were false, but this 1 is vaguely true if you interpret it my way, therefore the bible is infallible!"

I've seen people who speak to ghosts make more accurate predictions. If we're seriously going to dive this deep into hokey ideas, then I believe Nostradamus should be added to the discussion since his predictions, when interpreted in specific ways, have been fairly more accurate than xtian doctrine.

Although I can't be completely certain of this, it would seem likely that the xtians might prefer the "predictions" of Edward Casey, (due to his inherent bias).

" ... there shall come a time (not saying when) of great trials (not the O.J. one or, any specific case) and gnashings of teeth (who doesn't like the dramatic hyperbole of teeth-gnashings?) and in such dark days (even though days are periods of 'light', it's hyperbole, man) the invisible pink unicorn (wondered where that dude has been ...) shall touch his horn upon (whoa, nothing inappropriate there) the world (whew) and find it wicked (like that's any different than any other age) and pass (gas?) judgement upon it (whew again)."
-- not attributed to Nostradamus.
 

[jcribb16]

Since this thread is about the second coming, it's very helpful to know the timeline of events, prophesied even from Old Testament history through Revelation in the New Testament history, and which applies to today and beyond.  If anyone is interested, here is an illustrated timeline of the second coming, according to Revelation and other books of the Bible:

 http://www.thesecondcomingofchrist.org/rev01_timelines.htm   

Here's the first example given of one of the charted timelines, with explanations:

Revelation: Chapter 1 Timelines

The timelines used on this site are intended to aid the reader in understanding the order, extent, and concurrent events that are presented in the many prophetic passages in the Bible.  The reader is encouraged to see the webpage on this site to see the explaination of the timelines used on this site.  The following contains a portion of that webpage.

The timelines used in this website are general in nature and every effort has been made to assure their accurate depiction of the prophetic passages.  However, there are instances where attempting to be precise is unattainable with the tools available and due to the rise of clutter to the charts rather than clarity with too much detail.  These limitations are noted as they occur within this site.  Since these are generalized timelines, in many cases, intervals of time along the horizontal do not portray equal intervals of time, only the relative occurrence of one event with another.  In all cases, it is incumbent upon the reader to search the scriptures out for himself or herself, and evaluate the content of this site or any other source against what the Word of God says.

As with all timelines, the one used on this site begins with a very simple horizontal bar, as seen in the following graphic.  The book of Daniel helps in understanding prophecy in the Bible for many reasons.  The first reason is that the Lord reveals to Daniel, King Nebuchadnezzar, and to all peoples, His plan for the ages.  Beginning with Daniel 1, Daniel as a young man is carried away with other well-learned and skilled men and women away from Jerusalem to Babylon.  After some years of training, Daniel and his fellow Jews, and friends, completed their training and were matriculated within the Babylonian system of advisors to the king.  Within the verses of Daniel 2 are tremendous revelations concerning the major kingdoms that exist at the time of the prophesy revealed to Daniel by the Lord, and another three kingdoms that would follow.  Why were there only four kingdoms are identified in this prophesy?  Why was the revealed prophetic timeline truncated?  King Nebuchadnezzar's military conquests against Judah and Jerusalem, and not with Assyria, Egypt, or other great historical kingdoms, are key to understanding prophecy.  First, though the northern tribes had already been taken captive by the Assyrians much earlier than Nebuchadnezzar's conquest against Judah, the key to prophecy with regard to the nation of Israel is the land it was promised, Jerusalem, and the temple.  The earlier times, or other great world dynasties, such as in China, or other continents in the world are not considered, since they neither trampled underfoot, nor either controlled or significantly influenced the affairs in Jerusalem.  Jerusalem as a key in understanding prophecy is brought out in the prophetic timeline revealed to Daniel by the angel Gabriel, Daniel 9:21-25, in which the 70 prophetic weeks (490 years, see this discussion in this site on Daniel 9) begins with the order to restore and build Jerusalem, not just the temple.  As shown in Daniel 2:36-38, the era of the Gentiles began with the three military campaigns of King Nebuchadnezzar against Jerusalem, and will not end until the return of Jesus Christ to establish His millennial kingdom, as shown in Revelation 19:11-21 with the Lord's return and in Revelation 20, which is the Lord's reign on earth. 

The following graphic builds upon the basic timeline above, and illustrates the critical historical events and prophetic events yet to occur relative to the church age.  The date of this writing is still the church age, and serves as a reference point to much of what is written in this website.  As shown in the Lord's first earthly ministry, He had said that Jerusalem would continue to be trodden down by the Gentiles until their time was fulfilled, which again is the end of the seven years of tribulation, which is Armageddon.  This is the time of the Lord's return for His second advent, but at that time it will not be as a humble servant as the first time, but as King of kings and Lord of lords.  This is shown by the solid black arrow from left to right between the yellow oval with the scriptural reference to Luke 21:20-23, and the quotation of the scripture that appears in the yellow box.  The arrow head indicates the fulfillment of the Gentile age.

http://www.thesecondcomingofchrist.org/images/graphic-tl-1a.gif

http://www.thesecondcomingofchrist.org/images/timeline_all_critic_dates_gentile_age.gif

There are more in-depth timelines - these are just the basic first 2 of them.

I also want to say that I know a couple of you do not agree with this, and that is fine.  You can respond however you wish and that is fine, too.  I already expect disagreeing and/or answers given to make this look unreal and foolish.  That is the prerogative of those who disagree and make it known.  Whatever responses are given, your answers will be treated with respect and hopefully yours are also given with respect.

There are some, though, who do agree with this, and many who want to know more about His second coming.  It's not an easy subject to learn, but it definitely helps to learn about it and know more about what will happen when it comes. 

[falcon9]

Since this thread is about the second coming ...

Since this thread was posted in the debate & discuss subforum and you've elected to cut&paste, note that any rebuttal is directed toward the material which was c&p'd, (not the one who posted it - a distinction to bear in mind).

"However, there are instances where attempting to be precise is unattainable with the tools available and due to the rise of clutter to the charts rather than clarity with too much detail. Since these are generalized timelines, in many cases, intervals of time along the horizontal do not portray equal intervals of time, only the relative occurrence of one event with another." 

Just to clarify the above paragraph; the writer is attempting to equate "generalized timelines" with evidence of specific "prophesies" and present it as supporting evidence for events which haven't happened yet?  The 'explanation' for any 'prophetic inaccuracies', (and they all are), given is that precision "is unattainable with the tools available and due to the rise of clutter ...".  Let's see, what exactly would those "tools" consist of?  One can only speculate that they don't include reasoning from a valid premise or, such nit-picky little things like tangible evidence, otherwise such would be provided.

I also want to say that I know a couple of you do not agree with this, and that is fine.  You can respond however you wish and that is fine, too. 

You say it's fine but, is it dandy too - fine and dandy?  Because without the dandy, fine just isn't as sincere-sounding.
 

I already expect disagreeing and/or answers given to make this look unreal and foolish.  That is the prerogative of those who disagree and make it known.  Whatever responses are given, your answers will be treated with respect and hopefully yours are also given with respect.

Uh-huh well, given previous responses, (some as recently as less than three hours before posting the above contention.  That tends to make the contention somewhat dubious, (c.f.; « Reply #44 on: Today at 19:49:01 » Message ID: 549960, "Daily bible ..." thread).  The nature of the cut&pasted material itself is enough to "make this look unreal and foolish" under medium-close examination, (closer examination would no doubt bring more detailed rebuttal to the fore).  As for me, others may wish to argue about 'how many angels can dance on the head of a pin' type of "debates" however, my response has always been that if someone claims there are such things, let them produce evidence of it firest before counting hypothetically-dancing "angels", (or claims of strolls across unfrozen H2O).

[jcribb16]

Quote from: jcribb16 on June 07, 2012, 10:44:05 am
I also want to say that I know a couple of you do not agree with this, and that is fine.  You can respond however you wish and that is fine, too.

Quote from: falcon9:
You say it's fine but, is it dandy too - fine and dandy?  Because without the dandy, fine just isn't as sincere-sounding.
 

It's fine and dandy!  Thank you for your in-depth response and thoughts on this.   

[JediJohnnie]

I always find it amusing how Atheists (in my case,usually Falconer)will whine and complain that you're not "defending" your opinion with facts,then when you do,they have astonishingly little to say in reply.lol

[Falconer02]

I always find it amusing how Atheists (in my case,usually Falconer)will whine and complain that you're not "defending" your opinion with facts,then when you do,they have astonishingly little to say in reply.lol

Showing the usage of obvious logical fallacies are facts though. If you're referring to my first post in this thread, a simple google search is all it takes to find the statistics. Otherwise, the list was just based upon common sense.The prophecies are fiction and the freethinkers (including me) have already countered the arguments by showing these prophecies are false. I'm under the impression that you completely failed to read the thread and, as usual, like to name call and lie (just like a good xtian would...). If you have questions about what I have said in the past, please quote them and I'll kindly be more specific.

[falcon9]

I also want to say that I know a couple of you do not agree with this, and that is fine.  You can respond however you wish and that is fine, too.

You say it's fine but, is it dandy too - fine and dandy?  Because without the dandy, fine just isn't as sincere-sounding.
  

It's fine and dandy!  Thank you for your in-depth response and thoughts on this.  

If such in-depth responses are both fine and dandy, wouldn't replies which discuss them follow so as not to be 'hit-and-run' proclamations?

"If you don't want to hear the answer, don't ask the question."
-- anon

[loulizlee]

Chirp, chirp, chirp (oh, better not do that; it upsets people).  You are ramping up the humor again, eh, Falcon9?  And don't say this is a hit and run.  I am all over the place (just like you).

[falcon9]

Chirp, chirp, chirp (oh, better not do that; it upsets people). 

No, it's trolling, (with non-contextual nonsense, in a sort of 'second coming' of your trolling).  Whether or not it "upsets" people like the forum moderator is the only relevant point.

You are ramping up the humor again, eh, Falcon9?  And don't say this is a hit and run.  I am all over the place (just like you).

The cognizant difference is that my posts are significantly more contextual than yours, (something you'll notice while trying to reach 30 contributory posts for that monthly bonus).

[loulizlee]

And what is always needing to the last word called?  Psychological immaturity.

[falcon9]

And what is always needing to the last word called?  Psychological immaturity.

If there'd been no reply to that, it would apply to the one attempting such, (you).  Since I've elected to reply to mention that, it becomes your choice to reply or not to this response.

What a conundrum, eh?

“The meme for blind faith secures its own perpetuation by the simple unconscious expedient of discouraging rational inquiry.”
-- Richard Dawkins

[alaric99x]

Well falcon9, you're a true and skilled logician; as an old soldier, I salute you.  I must confess, I'm basically on here for those 30 posts, so i hope you'll excuse me if I'm not as active here as you are.

[falcon9]

Well falcon9, you're a true and skilled logician; as an old soldier, I salute you.  I must confess, I'm basically on here for those 30 posts, so i hope you'll excuse me if I'm not as active here as you are.

Danke schön.  In high school, someone did write in my yearbook, "Good luck you illegitimate son of Spock." (At first, I'd though they'd written a word that starts with a "b" instead of an "S").
 

[gaylasue]

I would like to be on earth when the Lord comes back for the church.  I think it would be the experience of a lifetime.  Even if the Lord decides to take me on home to heaven before his return, I'll still be there for eternity with Him and my loved ones that made the decision to take Glory instead of Hell for eternity.  If you do miss the first trip, you will have another chance during the great tribulation period, but if your heart has hardened you during this lifetime, circumstances may change your mind during the tribulation.  God will give you a chance until the door is shut forever.....