Do You Vote?

[bottomprice]

yes i do
i will vote for dem.

[sdenimandlace1]

I vote every election. would not miss it.

[rghvac69]

I vote as well. I haven't missed an election since 1988.

[lbryanwf]

I do a lot of research before I vote. I listen less to the promises and pay more attention to the background of the candidate. Specifically who were his mentors and associates prior to his political career. What were his political leanings, who did he admire? In the last unfortunate election, had most people ignored the phony "Hope and Change" mantra and promises of "free stuff" and looked more at the mans socialist and marxist leanings, his refusal to wear the American flag pin and my personal favorite...the "crotch salute" while the national anthem was being played, we would not be in the horrible mess we are today!

[falcon9]

... and my personal favorite...the "crotch salute" while the national anthem was being played ...

There was a "crotch salute"?  Was that captured on video?  The reason the questions arose was because it's unclear whether you meant he saluted a crotch, used his crotch to confer a salute or, something else and a picture would clarify your meaning.  Thanks in advance.  

[lbryanwf]

Regarding "crotch salute"....There are many many pictures of this taken by the media at various events. In short, during playing of national anthem,  or pledge of alliegence, surrounded by persons either saluting the flag, or with hands on hearts, there he stands with hands folded over his crotch, thus the term "crotch salute" You asked for a picture, here is one of many.....

http://media.photobucket.com/image/obama%20crotch%20salute/Renegade_in_TN/crotchsalute.jpg?o=1

[lbryanwf]

Re: "Crotch Salute"

The link to the picture posted previously may have to be clicked on to enlarge. Oh and by the way, said picture was from Veterans Day Ceremony, 11/11/09, Arlington National Cemetery. It may be the National Anthem or the Flag being presented, but EVERYBODY in the picture is either saluting or has his hand over the HEART ... except ONE

[falcon9]

Re: "Crotch Salute"

The link to the picture posted previously may have to be clicked on to enlarge. Oh and by the way, said picture was from Veterans Day Ceremony, 11/11/09, Arlington National Cemetery. It may be the National Anthem or the Flag being presented, but EVERYBODY in the picture is either saluting or has his hand over the HEART ... except ONE

Okay, in that still shot, Obama has his hands linked in front of his crotch area, (not a 'crotch-grabbing' salute as indirectly-implied).  Since he has placed his hand over his heart before for the Anthem, there's no way to tell whether or not he maintained the 'non-crotch-grabbed salute' or, had his hand over his heart 9 milliseconds after the picture was taken.  You do realize that "paparazzi" photographers can be quite adept at capturing an 'out-of-context' moment, (as Brittany Spear or Paris Hilton could confirm, for example).  

Hey, maybe Obama did maintain that 'non-grabbed crotch-area salute' until after the anthem finished.  Unfortunately, there isn't a comparative time-frame showing that the timespan durations of the anthem playing and a crotch not being grabbed coincided, (since it's been shown in other videos that civilian government employees are often 'pre-cued' before the anthem starts to do the hand-over-heart posturings).

[jordandog]

Regarding "crotch salute"....There are many many pictures of this taken by the media at various events. In short, during playing of national anthem,  or pledge of alliegence, surrounded by persons either saluting the flag, or with hands on hearts, there he stands with hands folded over his crotch, thus the term "crotch salute" You asked for a picture, here is one of many.....

http://media.photobucket.com/image/obama%20crotch%20salute/Renegade_in_TN/crotchsalute.jpg?o=1

And you just might want to check before parroting statements that are false and showing photos taken out of context. I am NO supporter of Obama, but I will defend him on this one. That photo is from the wreath laying ceremony and was taken just as he walked onto the stage while "Hail To the Chief" was playing. His hands are exactly where they are supposed to be according to ceremonial protocol. IF he HAD saluted, he would have been saluting himself....which is both foolish and highly inappropriate.
Any of you can check this out because the truth re the 'situation' (not just repeats of the same photo) is also in many places.

[falcon9]

Regarding "crotch salute"....There are many many pictures of this taken by the media at various events. In short, during playing of national anthem,  or pledge of alliegence, surrounded by persons either saluting the flag, or with hands on hearts, there he stands with hands folded over his crotch, thus the term "crotch salute" You asked for a picture, here is one of many.....

http://media.photobucket.com/image/obama%20crotch%20salute/Renegade_in_TN/crotchsalute.jpg?o=1

And you just might want to check before parroting statements that are false and showing photos taken out of context. I am NO supporter of Obama, but I will defend him on this one. That photo is from the wreath laying ceremony and was taken just as he walked onto the stage while "Hail To the Chief" was playing. His hands are exactly where they are supposed to be according to ceremonial protocol. IF he HAD saluted, he would have been saluting himself....which is both foolish and highly inappropriate.
Any of you can check this out because the truth re the 'situation' (not just repeats of the same photo) is also in many places.

Protocol requires military personnel to stand and salute their Commander-and-Chief while Hail To The Chief is being played; the civilian government employee protocol is the hand-over-the-heart during the same tune, (as depicted in the photograph).  So, the context was misrepresented as occurring during the playing of the National Anthem when the photo was actually taken during Hail To The Chief, as Jdog points out.

[Abrupt]

Regarding "crotch salute"....There are many many pictures of this taken by the media at various events. In short, during playing of national anthem,  or pledge of alliegence, surrounded by persons either saluting the flag, or with hands on hearts, there he stands with hands folded over his crotch, thus the term "crotch salute" You asked for a picture, here is one of many.....

http://media.photobucket.com/image/obama%20crotch%20salute/Renegade_in_TN/crotchsalute.jpg?o=1

And you just might want to check before parroting statements that are false and showing photos taken out of context. I am NO supporter of Obama, but I will defend him on this one. That photo is from the wreath laying ceremony and was taken just as he walked onto the stage while "Hail To the Chief" was playing. His hands are exactly where they are supposed to be according to ceremonial protocol. IF he HAD saluted, he would have been saluting himself....which is both foolish and highly inappropriate.
Any of you can check this out because the truth re the 'situation' (not just repeats of the same photo) is also in many places.

Protocol requires military personnel to stand and salute their Commander-and-Chief while Hail To The Chief is being played; the civilian government employee protocol is the hand-over-the-heart during the same tune, (as depicted in the photograph).  So, the context was misrepresented as occurring during the playing of the National Anthem when the photo was actually taken during Hail To The Chief, as Jdog points out.

A bit off topic, but once in the service during AIT I was running to the commissary (not allowed to walk, of course) and A second lieutenant was riding a bicycle in my direction.  With nowhere to 'hide' and not knowing the protocol I saluted him.  He returned and abruptly went off into a ditch and crashed.  Fortunately for me he wasn't upset at all and he explained he wasn't entirely certain of the protocol (I found out later he isn't supposed to return but I guess it is habit or something).

[falcon9]

A bit off topic, but once in the service during AIT I was running to the commissary (not allowed to walk, of course) and A second lieutenant was riding a bicycle in my direction.  With nowhere to 'hide' and not knowing the protocol I saluted him.  He returned and abruptly went off into a ditch and crashed.  Fortunately for me he wasn't upset at all and he explained he wasn't entirely certain of the protocol (I found out later he isn't supposed to return but I guess it is habit or something).

In a somewhat similiar incident, I was turning a corner on foot to enter a base commissary while different second louie was exiting with both arms full of grocery bags.  As I abruptly turned that corner, I whipped a quick salute to the officer who, being somewhat surprised, dropped the bags in his right hand as he returned the salute.  He may have glared at me as I continued on into the commissary but, said nothing and began picking up his groceries from the ground.  The LT. should have also been aware that he didn't need to return a salute if his arms were full but, "butterbars" are notorious for being sticklers for saluting protocol.  Serves 'em right.

[Abrupt]

A bit off topic, but once in the service during AIT I was running to the commissary (not allowed to walk, of course) and A second lieutenant was riding a bicycle in my direction.  With nowhere to 'hide' and not knowing the protocol I saluted him.  He returned and abruptly went off into a ditch and crashed.  Fortunately for me he wasn't upset at all and he explained he wasn't entirely certain of the protocol (I found out later he isn't supposed to return but I guess it is habit or something).

In a somewhat similiar incident, I was turning a corner on foot to enter a base commissary while different second louie was exiting with both arms full of grocery bags.  As I abruptly turned that corner, I whipped a quick salute to the officer who, being somewhat surprised, dropped the bags in his right hand as he returned the salute.  He may have glared at me as I continued on into the commissary but, said nothing and began picking up his groceries from the ground.  The LT. should have also been aware that he didn't need to return a salute if his arms were full but, "butterbars" are notorious for being sticklers for saluting protocol.  Serves 'em right.

Ha ha.  I bet he had a polished perfect salute that he practiced for at least two hours a night in the mirror.

[falcon9]

Ha ha.  I bet he had a polished perfect salute that he practiced for at least two hours a night in the mirror.

It's been speculated before that most "butterbars" are like those two.  Lots of Second Lt.s seem to 'seek out a salute' on purpose ... they sure get pissed when they don't get one.  For instance, in an unrelated incident at a different base, I'd been talking outside with 3 other sargents when I noticed a 2nd Lt. approaching toward us on foot.  After giving the others a brief heads up, we all made sure we were looking in any other direction than at the Lt. when he arrived.  The Lt. stopped and tried to catch our eyes but, (according to protocol, you have to see an outranking officer before saluting), we each contrived to be looking 'elsewhere' until he finally spoke asking, "Does anyone here remember how to salute a superior officer?!?"

Being the senior NCO there, I got to reply, "Sir, we didn't see one ... at first."  We then all snapped a salute at once as he growled and returned it.  It's sometimes necessary to remind junior officers that NCOs actually run things in the military.
 

[Abrupt]

Ha ha.  I bet he had a polished perfect salute that he practiced for at least two hours a night in the mirror.

It's been speculated before that most "butterbars" are like those two.  Lots of Second Lt.s seem to 'seek out a salute' on purpose ... they sure get pissed when they don't get one.  For instance, in an unrelated incident at a different base, I'd been talking outside with 3 other sargents when I noticed a 2nd Lt. approaching toward us on foot.  After giving the others a brief heads up, we all made sure we were looking in any other direction than at the Lt. when he arrived.  The Lt. stopped and tried to catch our eyes but, (according to protocol, you have to see an outranking officer before saluting), we each contrived to be looking 'elsewhere' until he finally spoke asking, "Does anyone here remember how to salute a superior officer?!?"

Being the senior NCO there, I got to reply, "Sir, we didn't see one ... at first."  We then all snapped a salute at once as he growled and returned it.  It's sometimes necessary to remind junior officers that NCOs actually run things in the military.
 

That is funny.  I have played the 'dodge' game too when I couldn't hide.  I found 'spots' to be even more insufferable (at least you don't have to salute them) than a 2nd Lt, but fortunately you don't have to deal with them often.

Have you ever been in the odd case where rank was not visible and the uniform was otherwise indistinguishable (but military, such as BDU's) and you had to address someone?