Snyder v. Phelps

[amyrouse]

Go here for the background: http://www.aclu.org/blog/free-speech/protecting-outrageous-offensive-speech


...so, what do you think?  Although I believe Phelps is a disgusting human being, the First Amendment does guarantee his right to free speech, no matter how emotionally hurtful...and it makes me ill to say that, legally, he is innocent of a crime.  Morally...that is another story.   

[animikokala]

I actually would say that the first amendment shouldn't protect him at all.  If people can sue for slander/libel, then there's no reason he shouldn't have to pay up.  Emotional distress has been used in lawsuits before successfully. 

[Falconer02]

Yeah I know about this. It bugs me a lot that these type of groups exist and do this sort of crap. The only way to quell this incompetent group of miserable assholes is to fight fire with fire. And fortunately there are a lot of counter-protests against Westboro.

To EVERYONE reading this thread- if there is ever a Westboro protest somewhere around where you live, gather whomever you can and tell them to bring loud devices, large american flags, and big signs preaching love to cover up whatever garbage they have. You must do this! For the good of humanity!

[jcribb16]

I agree, Falconer.  Maybe he wouldn't like the same treatment at one of his family member's funeral...

[FuzzyCottonsocks]

It's very disrespectful, but Phelps will probably win again. I wish that whole group would fall off the face of the earth. 

[ButterflyWings]

Yeah this is utterly disgusting..People like this are unhappy asses and should be made to look as dumb as they sound!!

[jordandog]

I actually would say that the first amendment shouldn't protect him at all.  If people can sue for slander/libel, then there's no reason he shouldn't have to pay up.  Emotional distress has been used in lawsuits before successfully. 

The problem is, the 'emotional distress' was listed in the lawsuit originally brought against Phelps. So it was taken into consideration in the ruling by the Supreme Court. It will do no good to try and file a second suit using that as a basis.
This, from the ACLU, sums it up well, no matter how much I or anyone else disagrees with it:

You don't need the courts to protect speech that everybody agrees with, because that speech will be tolerated. You need a First Amendment to protect speech that people regard as intolerable or outrageous or offensive — because that is when the majority will wield its power to censor or suppress, and we have a First Amendment to prevent the government from doing that.

[Mickey001]

Amy, great subject for all FC members to comment on.  I believe the bottom line in this case is that the Church members have the right to free speach.  Period.  I believe that the Supreme Court will side with the Church Members, however, they will introduce a "distance" rule to be applied against these idiots.  They will say that the idiots can not come any closer than a mile from the site of the burial ceremony.  I am making up the one mile as just an example, but the Supreme Court will rule on some type of "distance" clause.  This would prevent the nuts from ruining someone's right to a blessed ceremony.

What do you think?  Do you agree?

Once again, great subject to debate.

[amyrouse]

Amy, great subject for all FC members to comment on.  I believe the bottom line in this case is that the Church members have the right to free speach.  Period.  I believe that the Supreme Court will side with the Church Members, however, they will introduce a "distance" rule to be applied against these idiots.  They will say that the idiots can not come any closer than a mile from the site of the burial ceremony.  I am making up the one mile as just an example, but the Supreme Court will rule on some type of "distance" clause.  This would prevent the nuts from ruining someone's right to a blessed ceremony.

What do you think?  Do you agree?

Once again, great subject to debate.

Thank you, Mickey.  I try. 

The thing is, Phelps's group actually met with the cops before the protest and asked where they could stand for their protest, and they did what they were told.  I find what they do reprehensible and disgusting, but the law should protect them as much as it does the KKK and other hate groups.  In fact, this has me curious...I just jumped over to the Southern Poverty Law Center's hate map to see if Phelps's group is on the list, and it disappoints me to say he isn't... This is the heading he would fall under: http://www.splcenter.org/get-informed/intelligence-files/ideology/christian-identity (Note...this isn't against all Christians...read the link).

[animikokala]

Thank you, Mickey.  I try. 

The thing is, Phelps's group actually met with the cops before the protest and asked where they could stand for their protest, and they did what they were told.  I find what they do reprehensible and disgusting, but the law should protect them as much as it does the KKK and other hate groups.  In fact, this has me curious...I just jumped over to the Southern Poverty Law Center's hate map to see if Phelps's group is on the list, and it disappoints me to say he isn't... This is the heading he would fall under: http://www.splcenter.org/get-informed/intelligence-files/ideology/christian-identity (Note...this isn't against all Christians...read the link).

He's in there: http://www.splcenter.org/get-informed/intelligence-files/profiles/fred-phelps

Found him by scrolling down the "profiles" lists.

[amyrouse]

Thank you, Mickey.  I try. 

The thing is, Phelps's group actually met with the cops before the protest and asked where they could stand for their protest, and they did what they were told.  I find what they do reprehensible and disgusting, but the law should protect them as much as it does the KKK and other hate groups.  In fact, this has me curious...I just jumped over to the Southern Poverty Law Center's hate map to see if Phelps's group is on the list, and it disappoints me to say he isn't... This is the heading he would fall under: http://www.splcenter.org/get-informed/intelligence-files/ideology/christian-identity (Note...this isn't against all Christians...read the link).

He's in there: http://www.splcenter.org/get-informed/intelligence-files/profiles/fred-phelps

Found him by scrolling down the "profiles" lists.

Thank you for finding that!  I haven't been on the website in years.

[amyrouse]

This is kinda off-topic, but does the question of who will take over once Phelps dies kinda remind anyone of Repo! The Genetic Opera?

[jordandog]

This is kinda off-topic, but does the question of who will take over once Phelps dies kinda remind anyone of Repo! The Genetic Opera?

Amy, you have got to be kidding me. Seriously, I think you are only the third person I have ever come across who even knows the name of 'Repo'. Which character would be taking over for Phelps aka Rotti though? Luigi, the main Repo dude Nathan (I think that's right?), or a female impersonator who will rip his eyes out like Blind Mag did? Ooooh, could even be Pavi the one who is so egotistical and a narcissist! If he was like Pavi, he could just change his face and sneak into everything to p*ss people off!
Until you wrote this, I never would have thought about putting the 2 up aginst each other, but they are weirdly and very sickly similar.

[amyrouse]

This is kinda off-topic, but does the question of who will take over once Phelps dies kinda remind anyone of Repo! The Genetic Opera?

Amy, you have got to be kidding me. Seriously, I think you are only the third person I have ever come across who even knows the name of 'Repo'. Which character would be taking over for Phelps aka Rotti though? Luigi, the main Repo dude Nathan (I think that's right?), or a female impersonator who will rip his eyes out like Blind Mag did? Ooooh, could even be Pavi the one who is so egotistical and a narcissist! If he was like Pavi, he could just change his face and sneak into everything to p*ss people off!
Until you wrote this, I never would have thought about putting the 2 up aginst each other, but they are weirdly and very sickly similar.

That is so funny...as I was reading the article, Mark it Up started replaying in my head.  Luigi's line in the song about finding a hole and...yeah...fits, too.  I can kinda see Amber Sweet taking over...but all she wants to do is sing, get attention for herself, and get her zydrate fix.  But if you really think about it...someone that Paris Hilton would play in a movie would be a perfect leader for Phelps's radicalism.  Plus...the speculation is that Phelps's daughter will be the one to take over...only she doesn't stop at the anti-homosexuality message her father preaches.

My husband loves Repo and I had to hunt a copy of it down for his birthday!

EDIT: Plus, Paris is like totally ready to lead... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=khE6v1mL0q4

[jordandog]

Lung, brain, mark it up!
That's why only I have brains enough
Papa will leave GeneCo to me.....

Thanks, now I'll have that in my head all morning -

Yeah, Paris and Rihanna could like totally so like take over GeneCo and like totally take over as prez and vice prez too ya know.