Militant Atheists

[queenofnines]

Some background info...a few days ago, a teenaged family member of mine posted this statement on her social network profile: "obnoxious atheists are annoying".  This was a direct (although passive-aggressive) attack against ME.  A real b*tch move, considering all I did was post a link in her comments (and not even say anything along with it) to a website that showed the passages in the Bible that support slavery, relating to her post about how slavery had been outlawed in a particular state on that day.  It's not like I respond to her profile in this way all the time...I have a record of plenty of mundane responses that have nothing to do with the god issue.  I just thought it wouldn't kill her and whomever chose to visit it to be open-minded and LEARN some things, that's why I posted it.

I think if she didn't want it there she should have just deleted it and messaged me privately, telling me it bothered her, and I would have made note of that.  I honestly did not know she would react so sensitively to something like that, otherwise I wouldn't have posted it.  But for her to be immature about it to boot and stereotype me in a negative light is what upset me.

Anyway, the day after that happened, I log into YouTube and this is one of the videos I had recommended to me:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ulAl4OjwvG4&playnext_from=TL&videos=fVGVyPayX-c

I thought it was so sweet and beautiful, I almost thought there was a god for a sec for it being suggested to me.  lol   

Let me know your thoughts on the video and this prejudiced term "militant atheist"!!

[ButterflyWings]

Wow this video is so beautiful it has escaped me what words to say..I enjoyed it so much thanks for sharing it..It is thought provoking and  moving..

As for the term Militant Atheist its rude,disgusting and really makes anything it is put in front of seem bad and judgmental..The word Militant sounds dirty by itself lol..

Thanks again for this post Queens and the video I enjoyed it very much..

[liljp617]

I don't really care what you do and I think people's skin is often not thick enough, but I think you should focus on picking your battles.

I'm not sure I understand the context of the situation since there isn't much information, but basically all she did was make a "status" about slavery being ended in some area in the world?  And you replied with a link to show the Bible supports slavery?

I understand your point.  I take your point to be a truthful one.  But I don't get the connection between her comment and your response.  What did you intend to accomplish by your response?

[shernajwine]

i agreed with the video in the sense that Jehovah's witnesses are militant christians and highly annoying lol. there is no excuse for people killing and harrassing people in the name of ANY religion. i disagree with any violent act that is done in the name of religion. i may not agree with decisions people make or laws that are passed and sometimes (if it's someone i know well enough and am close enough to) i will let them know what i think about what they are doing.
but again it comes down to....christians aren't going to prove God by this behavior, it doesn't make anyone listen it just makes people mad...but same goes for an atheist who gets in people's faces with their views. (not saying you did that though)

[Rastov]

I think your complaint if I'm understanding it, is that you try to have a debate, she dodges and insults instead, yes?
This is to be expected. Christians today suffer from a victim mindset. Any disagreement is an attack on them and persecution.
Thier predecessors who died in the Roman colleseums would laugh at this terrible persecution, but I digress.

Christianity is incresingly becoming a wall of whine. This is why the number of deeply religious people are falling off dramatically. The old leaders like Billy Grahm are not to be found.
There' are a few leaders that are left, who aren't habitual whiners, but they're being shouted down and discredited by the old guard.
It's fine by me either way. The shelf life of ignorant and hostile Christianity is no more than 40 years. Either Joel Osteen and Rick Warren win, and it becomes driven mostly by a positive attitude and good deeds, or John Hagee and Ron Phillips win, and everyone stops bothering with church.
Humanity wins either way

[amyrouse]

I agree that the video is beautiful, and I'm not an atheist.  I just have a low tolerance for  and hypocrites.

[queenofnines]

I'm not sure I understand the context of the situation since there isn't much information, but basically all she did was make a "status" about slavery being ended in some area in the world?  And you replied with a link to show the Bible supports slavery?

Yes.  To be fair, there was also another example that she might be referring to before this happened that might have provoked her.  A fews before the slavery thing, she posted: "are people really still offended by the word *bleep* w o w catch up with the times".  I thought that was a really odd and inappropriate thing to say considering gays still face so much discrimination today, so I said:

"YES, and for good reason. We are living in a time when gays are discriminated against and persecuted just like the blacks were a few decades back. Because homosexuals have less rights than blacks do, '*bleep*' hasn't become innocent quite like '*bleep*' has. Haha, did I SHOCK anyone by saying that? Well it's true. So until gay marriage is legal for all, be careful who you say *bleep* to, k?"

Not necessarily anything to do with god, but I can see how she might have taken it as a lecture.

Her: "it's just another derogatory term"
Me: "Right, and I personally don't have anything against words like that (censorship is dumb), but it is still a sensitive word to some gay people given the awful context it is sometimes used in."

And that was the end of it.  Again, I am not posting things like this all of the time to people's profiles...just like the video says, I wait for THEM to bring it up.  I guess I just expect too much from a 16-year-old (her age).  

What did you intend to accomplish by your response?

Well certainly not for her to get angry with me and accuse me of being obnoxious!    I guess I didn't give it much thought at all, forgetting that some people get very offended when you bring up religion.  And that makes me very sad that I can't even talk to people decently about it on occasion; it gets protected by this blanket of "taboo".

[queenofnines]

The world would not be better off without God...it's simple....if you don't like christians preaching about God then don't preach about no God to a christian. Or anything else for that matter that has to do with no God.

That's unfortunate that you think the world wouldn't be better off.  Think of the millions of people we'll be able to save with stem cells alone (something religion has its grubby fingers around trying to prevent it).  I don't mind if Christians preach (as long as they're not doing it Westboro Baptist Church style); in fact I welcome it IF they're able to give the other side a fair say.  You don't seem to understand, marieelissa, it is not a situation in which atheists should just shut up about...

Another video to illustrate my point: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yjO4duhMRZk&playnext_from=TL&videos=Ld3aKwasB9g

Bear in mind, this one isn't so sweet compared to my original vid!  This guy would make a kick-*bleep* grandpa...  Warning: he gets more angry towards the end.  lol

[oonamas]

The world would not be better off without God...it's simple....if you don't like christians preaching about God then don't preach about no God to a christian. Or anything else for that matter that has to do with no God.

Respect a persons beliefs as you respect your own.

That's a lovely idea marieelissa, but it's not the way the world functions in reality - and actually for valid reason. If you think that your beliefs are the complete and unadulterated truth then it is impossible to respect beliefs that are the opposite of that.

Atheism and agnosticism were not considered acceptable beliefs in the past and you could actually be killed for voicing them. As a result virtually all atheists/agnostics were "in the closet" so to speak. In no way, shape or form did this cause the Christians (or any other religion for that matter) to stop preaching.

[queenofnines]

   My favorite part of the video is when he shows pictures of himself with his dog and has the label "Militant Atheist".  Ain't it the truth?  lol   

[liljp617]

What did you intend to accomplish by your response?

Well certainly not for her to get angry with me and accuse me of being obnoxious!    I guess I didn't give it much thought at all, forgetting that some people get very offended when you bring up religion.  And that makes me very sad that I can't even talk to people decently about it on occasion; it gets protected by this blanket of "taboo".

Well, the issue isn't necessarily shying away from offending people.  Offending others is part of life and people simply have to deal with it in a society that has, at its roots, freedom to express one's self.  Offend away, in my opinion  The truth is often offensive to people, but it is the truth nonetheless.  I believe its inevitable, and likely necessary, to offend others at certain points in time.

My problem is this really didn't seem like one of those "points in time."  Like I said, I think, especially on a topic like religion, that you really have to pick and choose your battles in public (I would include social networking sites "public" to a small extent).  If you pick the wrong battles, you come across as a "snide *bleep*," for lack of a better term...and when that happens, the message you're sending basically gets ignored.  At that point, what have you gained?  I think on topics like this, you have to tread lightly, but that doesn't mean offending people is off limits.

[queenofnines]

Like I said, I think, especially on a topic like religion, that you really have to pick and choose your battles in public (I would include social networking sites "public" to a small extent).  If you pick the wrong battles, you come across as a "snide *bleep*," for lack of a better term...and when that happens, the message you're sending basically gets ignored.  At that point, what have you gained?  I think on topics like this, you have to tread lightly, but that doesn't mean offending people is off limits.

Agreed.     'Tis a learning process...

[klkwid]

Some background info...a few days ago, a teenaged family member of mine posted this statement on her social network profile: "obnoxious atheists are annoying".  This was a direct (although passive-aggressive) attack against ME.  A real b*tch move, considering all I did was post a link in her comments (and not even say anything along with it) to a website that showed the passages in the Bible that support slavery, relating to her post about how slavery had been outlawed in a particular state on that day.  It's not like I respond to her profile in this way all the time...I have a record of plenty of mundane responses that have nothing to do with the god issue.  I just thought it wouldn't kill her and whomever chose to visit it to be open-minded and LEARN some things, that's why I posted it.

I think if she didn't want it there she should have just deleted it and messaged me privately, telling me it bothered her, and I would have made note of that.  I honestly did not know she would react so sensitively to something like that, otherwise I wouldn't have posted it.  But for her to be immature about it to boot and stereotype me in a negative light is what upset me.

Anyway, the day after that happened, I log into YouTube and this is one of the videos I had recommended to me:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ulAl4OjwvG4&playnext_from=TL&videos=fVGVyPayX-c

I thought it was so sweet and beautiful, I almost thought there was a god for a sec for it being suggested to me.  lol   

Let me know your thoughts on the video and this prejudiced term "militant atheist"!!

That was really low of your relative to do.  If she has a problem, she should say something.  If she doesn't want to say something directly, she should let it go.  The video has a lot of lovely pictures, but for the most part, it sounds like this guy might have some supressed anger issues   LOL! 

[jordandog]

I enjoyed the video and listened to what he was saying more than looking at the photos, they were stunning though. One thing he said really stood out when he talked about the JW he had coming to his door and their long, calm, and very interesting discussions. It can be accomplished even with both parties holding to their stances.  I also liked this as to we atheists who do speak out and 'debate': "There are those who challenge and those who acquiesce." No one on either side has to think if everyone just shakes their heads in agreement, even when they do not agree.

liljp summed it up well and it is definitely a learning process, queen. I try to keep the adage "Is it better to win a battle, but lose the entire war?" in my mind. Note I said TRY - some days it's easy and others I just take out my little slingshot, run full force ahead, and face-off against the Uzis. 

Like I said, I think, especially on a topic like religion, that you really have to pick and choose your battles in public (I would include social networking sites "public" to a small extent).  If you pick the wrong battles, you come across as a "snide *bleep*," for lack of a better term...and when that happens, the message you're sending basically gets ignored.  At that point, what have you gained?  I think on topics like this, you have to tread lightly, but that doesn't mean offending people is off limits.

Agreed.     'Tis a learning process...

[queenofnines]

That was really low of your relative to do.  If she has a problem, she should say something.  If she doesn't want to say something directly, she should let it go.

For the record, I messaged her privately after this happened and was basically like, "what the hell?!"  I got her to apologize, but it was one of those apologies that really isn't an apology because it immediately followed with 3 sentences on why she thought she was justified.