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Discussion Boards => Off-Topic => Debate & Discuss => Topic started by: 2persian4u on November 17, 2010, 02:58:00 pm
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I would like hard evidence of the existence of Jesus Christ in history (outside of the Bible and other similar writings). Now I understand that this is not exactly the easiest task, knowing that cities were burned to the ground and many historical references or witnesses may have been destroyed or lost in the sands of time. But you would think that such a historical figure would have SOME hard evidence to support his very existence. :dontknow:
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Outside of christianities cop-out reasonings and hilariously fake proof, you will find none. You think god/the son of god would make it more of a priority to get himself heard around the world while he existed. Instead, if he truly existed, he was nothing more than the small talk of the desert. I think QoN posted this a while back, but there's more evidence for aliens than there is for Jesus. Pretty funny-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1r0lO5nFEBA
The same could be said for pretty much all magical figures in all religions.
(http://faithinsociety.blogspot.com/uploaded_images/theology-795293.gif)
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Falconer, I just had a 'woowoo' moment as I call them - you know when something gives you goosebumps?
There is a satirical writer named Derek Janssen. He writes a lot of political, religious, worldview type articles and just about everything else. As soon as I saw that Peanuts cartoon, I remembered this from him and had to 'google' it and was amazed to find it!
Willful's when you believe you're right because you want to.
You may find freshman Philosophy majors irritating, but the first thing
they learn is, "How do you *know* you're right?"
(Or, as the title of Snoopy's one attempt at writing a theological book
put it, "Has It Ever Occurred To You, You Might Be Wrong?" )
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I would like hard evidence of the existence of Jesus Christ in history (outside of the Bible and other similar writings). Now I understand that this is not exactly the easiest task, knowing that cities were burned to the ground and many historical references or witnesses may have been destroyed or lost in the sands of time. But you would think that such a historical figure would have SOME hard evidence to support his very existence. :dontknow:
If you're going to use this criteria to judge the historicity of someone, you would have to apply this same standard to many other popular historical figures (around the same era) whose MSS dates are even further away than the Bible, which historians believe to have existed.
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The strongest evidence we have is no more then that we are forced to believe in religon and jesus etc....
I'm sure there is a jesus and he did good deeds and preached to people the word of god.
Don't get me wrong i'm very spiritual and I have alot of faith in god, I believe god is a divine entity and we are not physicaly in his own
image as they say, but we are in his spiritual image and we can't ever perfect it though because we can't be pure in the soul
hundred percent. I believe in a balance, a spiritual, mental, physical and so on everything needs a balance to prosper .
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Falconer, I just had a 'woowoo' moment as I call them - you know when something gives you goosebumps?
There is a satirical writer named Derek Janssen. He writes a lot of political, religious, worldview type articles and just about everything else. As soon as I saw that Peanuts cartoon, I remembered this from him and had to 'google' it and was amazed to find it!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHjFxJVeCQs
Willful's when you believe you're right because you want to. You may find freshman Philosophy majors irritating, but the first thing they learn is, "How do you *know* you're right?"
(Or, as the title of Snoopy's one attempt at writing a theological book put it, "Has It Ever Occurred To You, You Might Be Wrong?" )
I like it!
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my life is evidence. He changed my life and many others.
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my life is evidence. He changed my life and many others.
Mine too, and still changing it.
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Hi 2persian,
Archaeologists and Scientists have proven the Bible to be one hundred percent historically accurate. Jesus is the only figure in any religion who was crucified, died on the cross and rose again from the dead. He has blessed my life in so many ways!
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Hi 2persian,
Archaeologists and Scientists have proven the Bible to be one hundred percent historically accurate. Jesus is the only figure in any religion who was crucified, died on the cross and rose again from the dead. He has blessed my life in so many ways!
sources please!!!!
I say...you are 100% wrong
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Don't let the title of this link fool you there's a TON of extra-biblical(meaning nonbiblical) sources for Jesus by rulers and other high standing men in history.
http://www.westarkchurchofchrist.org/library/extrabiblical.htm
P.S. I used a church link, see I'm not biased and brainwashed and only resort to the watchtower 0_0.
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"Perhaps the greatest evidence that Jesus did exist is the fact that literally thousands of Christians in the first century A.D., including the twelve apostles, were willing to give their lives as martyrs for Jesus Christ. People will die for what they believe to be true, but no one will die for what they know to be a lie". -Excerpt from http://www.gotquestions.org/did-Jesus-exist.html
(http://www.gotquestions.org/did-Jesus-exist.html)
Detailed accounts of how the apostles were tortured & killed can be found in "Foxe's Book of Martyrs". Peter's cruel, torturous death was one where he suffered immensely. Peter's faith in Jesus has been the one that has been the greatest inspiration to me. Peter, the apostle who so easily denied knowing Jesus 3 times when Jesus was still alive.......refused to deny Jesus after Jesus' "death", even when it cost him his own life in a very cruel & torturous way. Peter suffered immensely as he was killed and all he had to do was deny Him "one more time" but Peter refused because he "believed". People just don't go around subjecting themselves to that kind of pain & torture unless they believe they KNOW "the truth".
I've read the "Foxe's book of Martyrs", and know what you speak of. Many Christians gave their life for their belief in Christ, and that is a witness of divine love and strong witness to their Faith. Many Christians were tormented and killed in the Roman Collosium for sport. I believe there is a Martyrs crown laid up for all those who give their life in the service of God receive.
However, there are many religions where they are laying down their lives for their God. The Muslim Allah comes to mind. These people are so brain washed that they believe that martyr in the name of Allah, grants them paradise immediately with virgins or whatever. While their at it, taking a few infidels with them is glorious...or so they are taught.
After the rapture, the plan of Salvation no longer applies, as the Spirit of God that "strived" with man, is gone. Everyone who has the Spirit of God in them is gone also. So how do people get saved during that time? The Bible talks of those being martyred that would not take the mark of the beast.
I think the only proof we can offer is to live our lives in accordance with the Word. We are the only Bible that some people will ever read. To be separated from the world and live for Jesus that died for us. It's our own personal testimony that will either declare His existence. It's Christ in us, the hope of glory. If we have passed from death unto life, a change will happen in our life. If we live Holy and separated from the world, the world will take notice that we are different. Many people that I knew before I knew Christ, are now saved because of the change in my life after my conversion. Not me, but the God that lives in me, that does the work, as I yield and submit to His Word. If we claim to know God, but live the same as we did before we were converted, then our witness is in vain.
We are demanded time and again to prove that God exists. We are the living epistles known and read of all men. As far as I know, that's the only "proof" God will give this generation. We can no more explain Faith, than how the bones of a child are knit in the womb of the mother. I've witnessed the infilling of the Holy Ghost with the evidence of speaking in other tongues. That is about as supernatural on this earth as you can get. Do people believe it? No. It's explained away with whatever. Thing is, I have it, and nobody can tell me that it's not real, and/or it's not God....I know better. The inner workings of the Spiritual Gifts that are associated with the same Spirit cannot be explained unless you have the Spirit of God to "quicken" them to you.
What I'm saying is they wanted a "sign" of proof in Jesus time also. Jesus went around healing, teaching, etc., and it got Him death on a cross from the religious leaders of that time. We ourselves need to be living testimonies of the existence of God.
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Good luck 2persian4u! If you find the answer, please, let me know!
I'm not saying that there wasn't a man named Jesus Christ back then, because it's very possible. I just don't believe that he was what people say he was.
and even if people will die for him doesn't really prove anything. Think about Charles Manson... had lots of followers... People will believe in crazy things and people will do crazy things for those crazy things they believe in... People be crazy, man. :P
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Members have made claims, in this thread, but so far no one has provided solid proof.
From my understanding, the earliest recorded mention of Jesus, was by Shakespeare, some 300 years after the claimed death of the man. Shakespeare wrote of Jesus the Christ.
I agree that there very well may have been a real person named Jesus, and he may or may not have believed that he was the savior, however, according to the teachings I have been gifted, he was not and certainly didn't die for me.
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Hi 2persian,
Archaeologists and Scientists have proven the Bible to be one hundred percent historically accurate. Jesus is the only figure in any religion who was crucified, died on the cross and rose again from the dead. He has blessed my life in so many ways!
Everytime I hear rose from the dead it makes me think of him as a zombie...
Don't yell at me... it was just a random thought!
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Hi 2persian,
Archaeologists and Scientists have proven the Bible to be one hundred percent historically accurate. Jesus is the only figure in any religion who was crucified, died on the cross and rose again from the dead. He has blessed my life in so many ways!
Everytime I hear rose from the dead it makes me think of him as a zombie...
Don't yell at me... it was just a random thought!
Actually since most Christians believe Jesus NEVER DIED and just rose up in the same body(reanimated corpse) that is exactly who they worship. A zombie man at the right hand of GOD!!!!!!!!!!!
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Hi 2persian,
Archaeologists and Scientists have proven the Bible to be one hundred percent historically accurate. Jesus is the only figure in any religion who was crucified, died on the cross and rose again from the dead. He has blessed my life in so many ways!
Everytime I hear rose from the dead it makes me think of him as a zombie...
Don't yell at me... it was just a random thought!
Actually since most Christians believe Jesus NEVER DIED and just rose up in the same body(reanimated corpse) that is exactly who they worship. A zombie man at the right hand of GOD!!!!!!!!!!!
Where do you get that "most Christians believe that Jesus never died"? ??? One of the tent poles of the Faith is that Jesus died for our sins.
You clearly don't understand the concept of the Resurrection.It is not comparable to reanimation,it's the Glorious renewing of the body.Just as Jesus was the first to be Resurrected,so shall we all someday.
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The apostles said they were witnesses to what they saw Jesus do. And Jesus also said that in his Father's house are many mansions. He was going to prepare a place for us and would return for us. He said if that was not true he would not say that. That's enough for me. Besides the fact he rose on the third day to eternal life after dying for our sins.
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Jedi, I'm with you. I've not heard of that one! Especially "most Christians?" I'd be interested to hear where he heard that or from where he read it.
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The apostles said they were witnesses to what they saw Jesus do. And Jesus also said that in his Father's house are many mansions. He was going to prepare a place for us and would return for us. He said if that was not true he would not say that. That's enough for me. Besides the fact he rose on the third day to eternal life after dying for our sins.
:thumbsup: