God is a Fake

[jcribb16]

We acknowledged winter solstice at my house.  What's this "christmas" you write of?

God made Christmas Eve. Not Christmas Steve.

It is the sun's declination, rather than a mythic deity's inclination, which results in the winter solstice being less luminous.
There's no inclination, sans declaration, to attribute Steve, Eve or Adam's being to a source more or less numinous.

Wow!  Such nice big words to try and make your point.  At least you are consistent in this and never give up.  Doesn't change anything, however, but keep up the hard work.

[falcon9]

We acknowledged winter solstice at my house.  What's this "christmas" you write of?

God made Christmas Eve. Not Christmas Steve.

It is the sun's declination, rather than a mythic deity's inclination, which results in the winter solstice being less luminous.
There's no inclination, sans declaration, to attribute Steve, Eve or Adam's being to a source more or less numinous.

Wow!  Such nice big words to try and make your point.  At least you are consistent in this and never give up.  Doesn't change anything, however, but keep up the hard work.

It was merely some sardonic solstice poetry however, irrational religious beliefs cannot change the phenomenon of solstice into something fictional.

[Falconer02]

Unfortunately, some in here do not agree with our believing in God.  They don't consider it an opinion either.  Rather that we believe in a myth or fairytale, etc.  They refuse to listen to any other view point unless a Christian can show proof of God from a scientific point of view only. They don't believe in the "faith" approach.

Basic proof is all that is asked for. People who do not agree with religious dogma do not refuse to listen. If that were true, the creationist movement would have never broken and collapsed into the ID movement. The problem is the "evidence" provided by believers is full of massive obvious problems and deranged thought processes (example- "To know I am right about my god existing, you must use faith and not know.") . When the problems are shed to light and challenged, it always goes back to the childish 'god-of-the-gaps' reasonings. And when you can fill a hole with a deity, you can fill it with literally anything that comes to mind.

I hope you had a Merry Christmas (which they don't agree with our reason of why we celebrate it either) with your family and friends.  

Well you do know the christians flat-out stole the original celebrations and morphed it into their own, right? In that case you'd be correct. We don't want to associate ourselves with thieves attempting to cover up the blotches on their record. But, like the *bleep* history of soccer, we like what it has become in the present- a good excuse to get together with friends and family and have a great time. With those aspects, I hope you had a Merry Xmas too!

[jcribb16]

Unfortunately, some in here do not agree with our believing in God.  They don't consider it an opinion either.  Rather that we believe in a myth or fairytale, etc.  They refuse to listen to any other view point unless a Christian can show proof of God from a scientific point of view only. They don't believe in the "faith" approach.

Basic proof is all that is asked for. People who do not agree with religious dogma do not refuse to listen. If that were true, the creationist movement would have never broken and collapsed into the ID movement. The problem is the "evidence" provided by believers is full of massive obvious problems and deranged thought processes (example- "To know I am right about my god existing, you must use faith and not know.") . When the problems are shed to light and challenged, it always goes back to the childish 'god-of-the-gaps' reasonings. And when you can fill a hole with a deity, you can fill it with literally anything that comes to mind.

I hope you had a Merry Christmas (which they don't agree with our reason of why we celebrate it either) with your family and friends.  

Well you do know the christians flat-out stole the original celebrations and morphed it into their own, right? In that case you'd be correct. We don't want to associate ourselves with thieves attempting to cover up the blotches on their record. But, like the *bleep* history of soccer, we like what it has become in the present- a good excuse to get together with friends and family and have a great time. With those aspects, I hope you had a Merry Xmas too!

Thank you for backing up what I explained to the other poster.  At least it proved I was telling her the truth. 

[falcon9]

Unfortunately, some in here do not agree with our believing in God.  They don't consider it an opinion either. 

On the contrary, such beliefs are nominally considered to be baseless opinions, (that is, having no evidentiary foundations).

Rather that we believe in a myth or fairytale, etc.  They refuse to listen to any other view point unless a Christian can show proof of God from a scientific point of view only. 

Your characterization isn't entirely accurate.  Firstly, there is no evidence that such religious beliefs have any substantive basis other than baseless 'faith'.  Secondly, no effective rational arguement has been presented to support such views, (sans the logically-invalid Pascal's Wager), let alone any "scientific point of view".

They don't believe in the "faith" approach. 

That was ironically phrased, (in essence, not having 'faith' in 'faith' is a humorous phrasing) however, it is basically correct since 'faith' is a belief despite, (and even in spite of), a lack of evidence.  If unreasoned spite constitutes an aspect of 'faith', more irony ensues.

[falcon9]

Thank you for backing up what I explained to the other poster.  At least it proved I was telling her the truth. 

What truth; that empty religious claims are often made and challenged?

[Falconer02]

Thank you for backing up what I explained to the other poster.  At least it proved I was telling her the truth.  

+

What truth; that empty religious claims are often made and challenged?

I suppose it depends on what the person thinks the difference is between "opinion" and "belief".

[falcon9]

Well you do know the christians flat-out stole the original celebrations and morphed it into their own, right? We don't want to associate ourselves with thieves attempting to cover up the blotches on their record. But, like the *bleep* history of soccer, we like what it has become in the present- a good excuse to get together with friends and family and have a great time.

It's a wonder how these xtians can selectively overlook such facts which contradict their evidence-lacking beliefs.  Must be an xmyth miracle.

[falcon9]

I suppose it depends on what the person thinks the difference is between "opinion" and "belief".

There remains a distinctive difference between a substantiated, (or, 'considered'), opinion and an unsupported one which continues to escape those holding religious 'beliefs'.

[Trace321]

I was an atheist until I realized I was God. That is too cool.

Why didn,t I think of that.

[Falconer02]

There remains a distinctive difference between a substantiated, (or, 'considered'), opinion and an unsupported one which continues to escape those holding religious 'beliefs'.

True.

[loulizlee]

I looked at this discussion shortly after it began - waaaay back when.  Then I looked at it a few days ago when I realized it was still going.  That is when I made a comment.  I don't mind if people call me names (although I thought that was not allowed on the forum).  However, it is interesting to me how vitriolic people can be when it comes to this subject.  It makes me wonder why people expend so much energy on a subject when neither side is likely to be swayed.  And, after all, you are entitled to your own opinions, as am I.  I also wonder how many people have done any in-depth studies on the subject - and I mean higher education, not just the Internet.  Have you really studied ancient Greek and Latin to find out how the languages have developed to the modern day, and thus many of the customs?  Have you studied archeology?  More and more of the modern archeologists have said that their work is proving that Biblical narratives and locations are more accurate than many people have believed.  Have you studied ancient history up to the modern day to see how countries and customs have evolved?  There is so much more involved than just taking a theory that someone has put forth and repeating it as fact.  Many years ago when I was a teenager I had many questions about the Bible and how certain things and events could have really been possible.  I have learned much since then after studying in college and doing personal research.  When you know how ancient writers wrote and how the Bible has been translated again and again, you realize that,  although much of it is written in the symbolism of the day, the core of the message is always the same.  I am not a literalist; I have a brain.  I hope you guys can find something more constructive to do than throwing slurs and calling people names and passing judgement on people you don't even know.  There are so many better ways to spend your energies - like helping the less fortunate. 

[Falconer02]

It makes me wonder why people expend so much energy on a subject when neither side is likely to be swayed.

The point is educating the uneducated and showing the obvious faults of their reasonings.

Have you really studied ancient Greek and Latin to find out how the languages have developed to the modern day, and thus many of the customs?  Have you studied archeology?  More and more of the modern archeologists have said that their work is proving that Biblical narratives and locations are more accurate than many people have believed.  Have you studied ancient history up to the modern day to see how countries and customs have evolved?

You ask these questions but post no proofs about what you mean.

Many years ago when I was a teenager I had many questions about the Bible and how certain things and events could have really been possible.  I have learned much since then after studying in college and doing personal research.  When you know how ancient writers wrote and how the Bible has been translated again and again, you realize that,  although much of it is written in the symbolism of the day, the core of the message is always the same.

First, where did you attend school? Second, if the core message exists, why are there thousands upon thousands of different sects of christianity that argue about the most mildest of things? "This word means this!" "No! It means this!". They tend to promote completely different core messages. Example being Catholicism vs. Westboro vs Latter Day Saints vs. etc. If you're going to tell me they fall to the good ol' "misinterpretation" excuse, you fall into a massive contradiction with your words.

I hope you guys can find something more constructive to do than throwing slurs and calling people names and passing judgement on people you don't even know.  There are so many better ways to spend your energies - like helping the less fortunate.

Or maybe learning a thing or two on some random forum that gives you money.

[falcon9]

I looked at this discussion shortly after it began - waaaay back when.  Then I looked at it a few days ago when I realized it was still going.  That is when I made a comment.  I don't mind if people call me names (although I thought that was not allowed on the forum). 

In which replies were you called names? Your complaint had no specific references and made an unspecified claim.

However, it is interesting to me how vitriolic people can be when it comes to this subject.  It makes me wonder why people expend so much energy on a subject when neither side is likely to be swayed.  And, after all, you are entitled to your own opinions, as am I. 

As mentioned, there is significant difference between an unsupported opinion, (religious belief), and a substantiated one.  Your 'entitlement' to an unsubstantiated opinion remains however, it still cannot be conflated to one which has a substantive basis.  It is somewhat revealing when religious proponents comment that they are unlikely to be swayed, (by reason opposing their 'faith').

I also wonder how many people have done any in-depth studies on the subject - and I mean higher education, not just the Internet.  Have you really studied ancient Greek and Latin to find out how the languages have developed to the modern day, and thus many of the customs?  Have you studied archeology? 

Yes, yes and yes.  I found my comparative religions courses to be remarkably similar to mythology studies.  The evidence showing how different cultures "borrowed" various beliefs and modified them was particularly emphasized by xtian cultural thefts.

More and more of the modern archeologists have said that their work is proving that Biblical narratives and locations are more accurate than many people have believed. 

Which ones; what references support your claim?

Have you studied ancient history up to the modern day to see how countries and customs have evolved?  There is so much more involved than just taking a theory that someone has put forth and repeating it as fact. 

Yep, have you, (not including any parochial schooling)?

Many years ago when I was a teenager I had many questions about the Bible and how certain things and events could have really been possible.  I have learned much since then after studying in college and doing personal research.  When you know how ancient writers wrote and how the Bible has been translated again and again, you realize that,  although much of it is written in the symbolism of the day, the core of the message is always the same.  I am not a literalist; I have a brain.  I hope you guys can find something more constructive to do than throwing slurs and calling people names and passing judgement on people you don't even know.

Again, what "slurs and calling people names" are you referring to?  This 'injured martyr' bit isn't uncommon when those making unsupported religious claims are challenged to substantiate their claims.

[falcon9]

It makes me wonder why people expend so much energy on a subject when neither side is likely to be swayed.

The point is educating the uneducated and showing the obvious faults of their reasonings.

Also, there is the off-chance that reason will be employed instead of making unreasoned and unsupported claims.