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Topic: Fallout of Hate Is Spreading Across America from 9/11 Site  (Read 60195 times)

jcribb16

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Re: Fallout of Hate Is Spreading Across America from 9/11 Site
« Reply #195 on: September 06, 2010, 01:10:13 pm »
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Jhx_2TqffE
Check this out re: Muslims/Obama
This just came out today.

SurveyMack10

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Re: Fallout of Hate Is Spreading Across America from 9/11 Site
« Reply #196 on: September 06, 2010, 01:10:35 pm »
I just feel that there should be a point where minorities have some consideration for people who are hurting...We ALWAYS have freedom for minorities, but when it comes to freedom for "regular ol' Americans" it's a bit more limited. A Muslim can stand up in the media and claim a Christian is against their religion and blah blah blah, but if a Christian did the same it would be considered prejudice. If a black man stands up in the news and says white people are being racist towards him then he win and the white man is wrong, if vice versa occurs then the black man still wins and the white man being a victim of reverse racism will be dsiregarded. When a "regular ol'" church wanted to be rebuilt after 9/11 it wasn't ok, but a mosque HAVE AT IT. It's only gonna offend the people that lost their lives or their loved ones that day, and hell a lot of them are "regular ol'" Americans anyway...

I agree with a lot that you said, I just think there should be a point where people start being thankful for their freedom and stop taking advantage of it. Obama is gonna let them do whatever they want anyway.

You have brought up the subject of minorities and their [seemingly] unlimited freedom several times in this thread. To say "We ALWAYS have freedom for minorities" is painting a pretty broad stroke don't you think? Can you honestly say ALWAYS and back it up because there are many times when 'minorites' have had very little freedom in as far as laws, housing, basic rights, and many other areas of life we take for granted. This is evidenced just by looking at how this country was formed and how it is TODAY also.
Quote
When a "regular ol'" church wanted to be rebuilt after 9/11 it wasn't ok, but a mosque HAVE AT IT.
What church are you talking about here?

I am working today, so I won't be back on until later tonight to see any reply.

There was a Greek Orthodox church destroyed in 9/11 that wasn't allowed to be rebuilt, unless I am totally misinformed in which case I apologize.

Annella

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Re: Fallout of Hate Is Spreading Across America from 9/11 Site
« Reply #197 on: September 06, 2010, 01:39:40 pm »
I just feel that there should be a point where minorities have some consideration for people who are hurting...We ALWAYS have freedom for minorities, but when it comes to freedom for "regular ol' Americans" it's a bit more limited. A Muslim can stand up in the media and claim a Christian is against their religion and blah blah blah, but if a Christian did the same it would be considered prejudice. If a black man stands up in the news and says white people are being racist towards him then he win and the white man is wrong, if vice versa occurs then the black man still wins and the white man being a victim of reverse racism will be dsiregarded. When a "regular ol'" church wanted to be rebuilt after 9/11 it wasn't ok, but a mosque HAVE AT IT. It's only gonna offend the people that lost their lives or their loved ones that day, and hell a lot of them are "regular ol'" Americans anyway...

I agree with a lot that you said, I just think there should be a point where people start being thankful for their freedom and stop taking advantage of it. Obama is gonna let them do whatever they want anyway.

You have brought up the subject of minorities and their [seemingly] unlimited freedom several times in this thread. To say "We ALWAYS have freedom for minorities" is painting a pretty broad stroke don't you think? Can you honestly say ALWAYS and back it up because there are many times when 'minorites' have had very little freedom in as far as laws, housing, basic rights, and many other areas of life we take for granted. This is evidenced just by looking at how this country was formed and how it is TODAY also.
Quote
When a "regular ol'" church wanted to be rebuilt after 9/11 it wasn't ok, but a mosque HAVE AT IT.
What church are you talking about here?

I am working today, so I won't be back on until later tonight to see any reply.

There was a Greek Orthodox church destroyed in 9/11 that wasn't allowed to be rebuilt, unless I am totally misinformed in which case I apologize.

Minorities have every opportunity that everyone does.  In fact, some rules have been bent for them to get better opportunities for college entrance and jobs too.  The only time minorities are not getting the same opportunities, are when they are trying to do it illegally.  If you live in the US, you must be a citizen, or have citizenship papers.

If your trying to refer back to the slave trade......that's been abolished.  You want Mackenzie to "prove" her stance that minorities are being treated fairly.  You say they haven't in laws, housing, basic rights, etc.  We have laws in place just for the minorities.  Where are they being mistreated?  Where don't they have the same basic rights that we do?

In other countries minorities are still being discriminated against.  Turkey is a great offender.  Canada, our top neighbor unfortunately has a problem with certain minorities.  The US has done much, and still is doing much to make sure minorities have every opportunity, like any American.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2010, 04:00:41 pm by Annella »

Annella

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Re: Fallout of Hate Is Spreading Across America from 9/11 Site
« Reply #198 on: September 06, 2010, 02:09:16 pm »
I just feel that there should be a point where minorities have some consideration for people who are hurting...We ALWAYS have freedom for minorities, but when it comes to freedom for "regular ol' Americans" it's a bit more limited. A Muslim can stand up in the media and claim a Christian is against their religion and blah blah blah, but if a Christian did the same it would be considered prejudice. If a black man stands up in the news and says white people are being racist towards him then he win and the white man is wrong, if vice versa occurs then the black man still wins and the white man being a victim of reverse racism will be dsiregarded. When a "regular ol'" church wanted to be rebuilt after 9/11 it wasn't ok, but a mosque HAVE AT IT. It's only gonna offend the people that lost their lives or their loved ones that day, and hell a lot of them are "regular ol'" Americans anyway...

I agree with a lot that you said, I just think there should be a point where people start being thankful for their freedom and stop taking advantage of it. Obama is gonna let them do whatever they want anyway.

You have brought up the subject of minorities and their [seemingly] unlimited freedom several times in this thread. To say "We ALWAYS have freedom for minorities" is painting a pretty broad stroke don't you think? Can you honestly say ALWAYS and back it up because there are many times when 'minorites' have had very little freedom in as far as laws, housing, basic rights, and many other areas of life we take for granted. This is evidenced just by looking at how this country was formed and how it is TODAY also.
Quote
When a "regular ol'" church wanted to be rebuilt after 9/11 it wasn't ok, but a mosque HAVE AT IT.
What church are you talking about here?

I am working today, so I won't be back on until later tonight to see any reply.

There was a Greek Orthodox church destroyed in 9/11 that wasn't allowed to be rebuilt, unless I am totally misinformed in which case I apologize.

Saint Nicholas Greek Orthodox Church.

jordandog

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Re: Fallout of Hate Is Spreading Across America from 9/11 Site
« Reply #199 on: September 06, 2010, 05:10:33 pm »
I just feel that there should be a point where minorities have some consideration for people who are hurting...We ALWAYS have freedom for minorities, but when it comes to freedom for "regular ol' Americans" it's a bit more limited. A Muslim can stand up in the media and claim a Christian is against their religion and blah blah blah, but if a Christian did the same it would be considered prejudice. If a black man stands up in the news and says white people are being racist towards him then he win and the white man is wrong, if vice versa occurs then the black man still wins and the white man being a victim of reverse racism will be dsiregarded. When a "regular ol'" church wanted to be rebuilt after 9/11 it wasn't ok, but a mosque HAVE AT IT. It's only gonna offend the people that lost their lives or their loved ones that day, and hell a lot of them are "regular ol'" Americans anyway...

I agree with a lot that you said, I just think there should be a point where people start being thankful for their freedom and stop taking advantage of it. Obama is gonna let them do whatever they want anyway.

You have brought up the subject of minorities and their [seemingly] unlimited freedom several times in this thread. To say "We ALWAYS have freedom for minorities" is painting a pretty broad stroke don't you think? Can you honestly say ALWAYS and back it up because there are many times when 'minorites' have had very little freedom in as far as laws, housing, basic rights, and many other areas of life we take for granted. This is evidenced just by looking at how this country was formed and how it is TODAY also.
Quote
When a "regular ol'" church wanted to be rebuilt after 9/11 it wasn't ok, but a mosque HAVE AT IT.
What church are you talking about here?

I am working today, so I won't be back on until later tonight to see any reply.

There was a Greek Orthodox church destroyed in 9/11 that wasn't allowed to be rebuilt, unless I am totally misinformed in which case I apologize.

Saint Nicholas Greek Orthodox Church.
I am pulling my own post from the same topic that Falconer had started, some of us replied, and then everyone basically 'switched over' to this thread about it. Here is that post with some additional info:

August 24, 2010
Some want Ground Zero church rebuilt
Supporters of a Greek Orthodox church destroyed on Sept. 11 say officials willing to speak out about a planned community center and mosque near ground zero have been silent on efforts to get the church rebuilt, the Associated Press reports.

But the World Trade Center site's owner says a deal to help rebuild St. Nicholas Greek Orthodox Church was offered and rejected, after years of negotiations, over money and other issues.

Though the projects are not related, supporters — including George Pataki, New York's governor at the time of the Sept. 11 attacks — have questioned why public officials have not addressed St. Nicholas' future while they lead a debate on whether and where the Islamic cultural center should be built.

"What about us? Why have they forgotten or abandoned their commitment to us?" asked Father Alex Karloutsos, assistant to the archbishop of the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America. "When I see them raising issues about the mosque and not thinking about the church that was destroyed, it does bother us."


The section that I bolded, about the owners of the parcel of land, is referring to the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey — the agency that owns ground zero. There is also this, which is apparently being refuted by the Greek Orthodox leaders:

"The agency said the church stopped negotiating after rejecting an offer in 2008 of $20 million in financing, plus up to an additional $40 million to cover costs related to the construction of a parking lot underneath the church.

Port Authority officials said the church wanted final approval on the design of the parking lot and the potential for an additional $20 million in public money. The agency said it made a final offer in 2009 that was rejected.

"St. Nicholas Church continues to retain the right to build on its original location," the agency said in a statement Monday. It said work could begin in 2013 if the church helped finance it."

That AP release is from the Baltimore Sun and the rest of the article can be found by scrolling down.
http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/news/faith/politics/

I labored through 'Labor Day' (on less than 4 hours sleep since my last shift) and am crawling into bed right now before my head hits the keyboard, so I will be back tomorrow.


« Last Edit: September 06, 2010, 05:32:23 pm by jordandog »
You are entitled to your own opinion, but you are not entitled to your own facts.

Annella

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Re: Fallout of Hate Is Spreading Across America from 9/11 Site
« Reply #200 on: September 06, 2010, 06:02:22 pm »

Supporters of a Greek Orthodox church destroyed on Sept. 11 say officials willing to speak out about a planned community center and mosque near ground zero have been silent on efforts to get the church rebuilt, the Associated Press reports.

But the World Trade Center site's owner says a deal to help rebuild St. Nicholas Greek Orthodox Church was offered and rejected, after years of negotiations, over money and other issues.

Though the projects are not related, supporters — including George Pataki, New York's governor at the time of the Sept. 11 attacks — have questioned why public officials have not addressed St. Nicholas' future while they lead a debate on whether and where the Islamic cultural center should be built.

"What about us? Why have they forgotten or abandoned their commitment to us?" asked Father Alex Karloutsos, assistant to the archbishop of the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America. "When I see them raising issues about the mosque and not thinking about the church that was destroyed, it does bother us."

In an effort to deal with the furor over the planned location of the Islamic center, Gov. David Paterson has suggested that state land farther away from ground zero be used. He was scheduled to meet with New York Archbishop Timothy Dolan on Tuesday to discuss the Park51 project, which is planned for two blocks north of the 16-acre World Trade Center site.

"Rather than focus his attention on the mosque, Gov. Paterson should step in right away to ensure that the state of New York and the Port Authority uphold the agreement with the Greek Orthodox church so this project can go forward without further delay," state Sen. Dean Skelos said Monday.

Paterson declined to comment on the issue.

The 300-member congregation lost its 90-year-old parish just south of the World Trade Center when the twin towers collapsed on Sept. 11, 2001, leaving only a handful of artifacts that were removed from the rubble, including a small bell and cross, a crucifix and wax candles that had not melted.

Leaders of the church and the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey — the agency that owns ground zero — have spent years negotiating a deal that would let the church rebuild on land a bit farther south than the 1,200-square-foot lot it sat on, in exchange for financial help to rebuild it.

The agency said the church stopped negotiating after rejecting an offer in 2008 of $20 million in financing, plus up to an additional $40 million to cover costs related to the construction of a parking lot underneath the church.

Port Authority officials said the church wanted final approval on the design of the parking lot and the potential for an additional $20 million in public money. The agency said it made a final offer in 2009 that was rejected.

"St. Nicholas Church continues to retain the right to build on its original location," the agency said in a statement Monday. It said work could begin in 2013 if the church helped finance it.

Karloutsos, the archbishop's assistant, denied that any offer had been rejected, instead saying that Port Authority pulled the deal and has since ignored the church's attempts at dialogue. "This is about the Port Authority reneging on a promise," he said.


Pataki, who as governor promised that St. Nicholas would be rebuilt after the 2001 attacks, said Monday that the Port Authority needed to reach out to church officials.

"It's just wrong that the rebuilding of St. Nicholas Church, which was there, which was part of the master plan ... has basically been ignored," he said.

George Demos, a Long Island Republican congressional candidate seeking to unseat Rep. Tim Bishop, said he wrote President Barack Obama a letter lobbying for the church.

"All of our political leadership seems intent on assisting the mosque, at the same time they have taken no steps to make sure St. Nicholas is rebuilt," he said.

Both Demos and Pataki are opposed to building an Islamic center and mosque at a building two blocks north of the World Trade Center site. The uproar over the proposed $100 million center has become a national campaign issue and led hundreds to rally in front of ground zero over the weekend.

Critics of the project say it's an affront to the memories of the more than 2,700 people killed at ground zero on Sept. 11 to locate the center so close to the site. Proponents say accepting the center respects religious freedom and tolerance.


So I'm wondering what is what?  Is it being denied or not?  This article says both.  I'm going to be running out of my gogo, so I'm out.

SurveyMack10

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Re: Fallout of Hate Is Spreading Across America from 9/11 Site
« Reply #201 on: September 06, 2010, 10:29:55 pm »
How about we do away with the Christian Religion and stop them from putting up churches because all it does is teach people that if someone doesn't believe in "their" God they go to HELL and they are evil people.

How about because it teaches them to shun gay people and hate them and protest and BOMB abortion clinics.

They also bother people with this Devil stuff and torment young children saying the Devil is real..

DO YOU HONESTLY THINK YOUR RELIGION IS ANY BETTER?

If I were you I'd just discontinue my use of the forum. I'm not saying you don't have the right to, I'm just saying you contradict yourself constantly until you have a terrible reputation and no one wants to read anything you say. I've read other threads of you claiming to be a Christian, then you bash them haha. That's fine it's your opinion, but earlier you claimed to believe the opposite.

SurveyMack10

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Re: Fallout of Hate Is Spreading Across America from 9/11 Site
« Reply #202 on: September 06, 2010, 10:31:35 pm »
Life is so screwed up because people are so screwed up...it's like whatever, I have bigger issues to worry about than some mosque...  :peace:
THEN DON'T COME TO A THREAD THAT IS HERE SOLELY TO DISCUSS THE BUILDING OF A MOSQUE.

SurveyMack10

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Re: Fallout of Hate Is Spreading Across America from 9/11 Site
« Reply #203 on: September 06, 2010, 10:32:56 pm »
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Jhx_2TqffE
Check this out re: Muslims/Obama
This just came out today.
Absolutely terrifying. Great post thanks for sharing!

tantricia44

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Re: Fallout of Hate Is Spreading Across America from 9/11 Site
« Reply #204 on: September 06, 2010, 11:37:45 pm »
Quote
To my Christian friends....do you know that the word "Islam" means peace and safety?  If you know your Word, you will make the connection.

That is not correct, but is a common mistake. The word Salam is a noun and means peace. Islam is an Arabic verb, not a noun, and means submission, surrendering, and obeying in order to achieve Salam or 'peace'.

The words/meanings seem so contradictory. When I see women raised to submit to the men. (cover up from head toe)I don't see that as peace more like mastery over the weaker sex. The male counter parts are allowed to go out whoring but if a woman get's raped; She is blamed & shot to death by her own family member. They call it honor killings. You don't hear about the rapist being put to justice. The Brother that shot his sister to death get's a few days in prison. So, the only people in Islam that are really submitting,surrendering, obeying in order to achieve Salam/peace are the women. Women=Islam=Salam=RIP. We *bleep* about r problems here in the US but I thank my lucky stars that I am an American. Sorry, I needed to vent. :peace:

SurveyMack10

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Re: Fallout of Hate Is Spreading Across America from 9/11 Site
« Reply #205 on: September 07, 2010, 12:16:53 am »
Quote
To my Christian friends....do you know that the word "Islam" means peace and safety?  If you know your Word, you will make the connection.

That is not correct, but is a common mistake. The word Salam is a noun and means peace. Islam is an Arabic verb, not a noun, and means submission, surrendering, and obeying in order to achieve Salam or 'peace'.

The words/meanings seem so contradictory. When I see women raised to submit to the men. (cover up from head toe)I don't see that as peace more like mastery over the weaker sex. The male counter parts are allowed to go out whoring but if a woman get's raped; She is blamed & shot to death by her own family member. They call it honor killings. You don't hear about the rapist being put to justice. The Brother that shot his sister to death get's a few days in prison. So, the only people in Islam that are really submitting,surrendering, obeying in order to achieve Salam/peace are the women. Women=Islam=Salam=RIP. We *bleep* about r problems here in the US but I thank my lucky stars that I am an American. Sorry, I needed to vent. :peace:
So true.

tantricia44

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Re: Fallout of Hate Is Spreading Across America from 9/11 Site
« Reply #206 on: September 07, 2010, 12:25:53 am »
I hope they do build it  8)

Oh I remember in march of 2000 being in NYC in a cop car looking for my grandmother because we got seperated and I had a thought in my head that urged me to get out of the cop car after the cops pointed out the world trade center and tell everyone that passed by that it was going to burn down...I thought I was just thinking crazy and ignored it...but damn it did burn down.

It is sorta like Final Destination without death coming to get the survivors.
So you're saying a cop told you it was going to burn down? WOW. I'm guessing you're one of those conspiracy theory people???

oh, and that post didn't make sense.


Cause you are a retard...I am psychic!! CAN YOU READ?
More like Psychotic!!!! Your responses sound like a misbehaving child having a screaming fit. Hello, we are suppose to be adults here in this forum. If you are under age, you need to get off!!!!

No, 13 years old can be on here. Not everyone has to be an adult.
I don't think so. 13 is not old enough to reason with difficult adult subjects such as what this forum is about. You can't even do surveys unless you are 18yrs old. Check out the rules please. You are barely a preteen & too young to discuss these types of issues. Don't try to grow up so fast. Youth will gone fast enough. Just enjoy being a kid.

Annella

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jordandog

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Re: Fallout of Hate Is Spreading Across America from 9/11 Site
« Reply #208 on: September 07, 2010, 06:12:10 am »
@tantricia44:
Quote
I don't think so. 13 is not old enough to reason with difficult adult subjects such as what this forum is about. You can't even do surveys unless you are 18yrs old. Check out the rules please. You are barely a preteen & too young to discuss these types of issues. Don't try to grow up so fast. Youth will gone fast enough. Just enjoy being a kid.
Maybe I misunderstood this and you were not talking to marieelissa about HER age, but she is 28 years old, not 13. If you were just reiterating the TOS, my bad, but it sounds as if you think SHE is that young.
You are entitled to your own opinion, but you are not entitled to your own facts.

jordandog

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Re: Fallout of Hate Is Spreading Across America from 9/11 Site
« Reply #209 on: September 07, 2010, 08:19:07 am »
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Jhx_2TqffE
Check this out re: Muslims/Obama
This just came out today.

I am surprised that anyone would buy into this right wing propaganda. I watched the video and heard names I am familiar with, especially that of Ahmed Aboul Gheit, the Egyptian Foreign Minister. He makes NO effort whatsoever, and never has, to hide his absolute and unrelenting hatred of the Jewish State of Israel and the Jewish people. While Obama DID meet with him in January of 2009, there is absolutely no confirmation that the words supposedly heard on Nile TV were in fact said. I have stated before I am NOT a supporter of Obama, but when things like this video start riling up the masses again someone has to speak up about it.

PP Simmons, the video 'host' has tons of videos out there and no one knows who it actually is, but their agenda is quite clear. The only purpose behind their videos is to further political conspiracy theory on just about every person and subject imagineable. They also make blatant use of mixing sound bites, photoshopping things, and basically preying on the feelings of strongly aligned christian groups.

Does it not occur to anyone that there is a reason these stories do NOT appear anywhere else ie in major news groups publications and TV broadcasts? There are many purveyors of the news that detest Obama and would do anything they could to show some really great 'dirt' on him. Yet, they do not pick up these types of stories and put them out for all to see? Seems pretty strange to me.
You are entitled to your own opinion, but you are not entitled to your own facts.

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